Jocks on forums?

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Ray
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Ray »

Earl wrote:Hi, Ray! :D

We missed you. :(
Ray wrote:If it was up to me, I'd rename this site whack-a-jock club because apparently "sports suck" isn't getting the point across.
I could be wrong, but I believe that renaming the site "Whack-A-Jock Club" would attract even more abusive posters. Perhaps some might even think that a site with this name merely ridiculed individual professional athletes for not performing up to par or whatever; in other words, even more sports fans would show up. Again, I could be wrong. I'm just throwing out a few thoughts (my two cents' worth, as it were).

:) I bet you're right --I was just kiddin' tho. I was just trying to give a little support to an earnest appeal.
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Earl »

Ray wrote:I personally don't have much use for sports fans and aren't really interested in their point of view. Or anything they have to say. I'm pretty familiar with it from my daily interactions [Earl's italics]. If it was up to me, I'd rename this site whack-a-jock club because apparently "sports suck" isn't getting the point across.
Hi, Ray. Believe me, although I'm retired and don't work in an office where I'd probably be hearing a lot of fans blathering about sports, I'm very sympathetic to your point of view (which I also share). I agree completely that this forum should be a place where views critical of the sports culture can be expressed freely.

There's a certain fellowship to be enjoyed here. I've noticed a common reaction from many of those who find this website and leave messages of support (whether in one of the "Letters" columns, the Guestbook, or the forum): "I thought I was the only one who didn't like sports." This forum can serve as more than just a rant board. Issues can be discussed, and members can be encouraged and possibly even learn something beneficial.

The problem is that we are not a private club. We'd like to be; but since we're a website, we're open to the public. So, yes, we're going to attract visiting sports fans who are abusive. Some are going to be quickly offended and will leave snotty or hateful messages and not return. Some sports fans will post in the forum just because they like to debate. Others may think sincerely that we're mistaken and try to straighten us out, and still others will just be merely curious. So, sports fans will come eventually.

And we seem to be in a dilemma. Sports fans, even the abusive ones, seem to add a certain something to the forum. (Of course, the abuse can be tolerated only to a certain point.) They seem to add life to the forum. When there are no sports fans at all posting in the forum, there's less activity. See what I mean when I say that we're in a dilemma? To borrow an expression from a completely different setting: Sports fans. You can't live with 'em, and you can't live without 'em.
Ray wrote:But I am just a member and certainly not the smartest.
Ray, you're very smart. :)
ChrisOH wrote:Just to wrap up this discussion, possibly (which would be nice of me to do, since I started it, no? :) ):
Well, ChrisOH, I sort of got in the way of your intention to wrap up this thread, didn't I? :lol:
ChrisOH wrote:I have a very conflicted view of sports right now, and having a place where I can vent and say things I ordinarily wouldn't say is very helpful to me in dealing with some of the sports-related issues in my life.
Could you share your conflicted view of sports with us. I would be interested in knowing what the source is of this conflict in your life. I'm sure that some, if not all, of us would be able to relate to it. This forum definitely is the place to vent and say things that you ordinarily wouldn't say.
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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Ray wrote: I personally don't have much use for sports fans and aren't really interested in their point of view. Or anything they have to say.
Yeah, and you don't even really need an actual sports bore around to simulate the effect of talking to one of them, anyway.

All you need to do, to simulate the effect of talking to a sports bore, is this...
Banghead.gif
Banghead.gif (1.99 KiB) Viewed 987 times
"We can’t find a healthy brain in an ex-football player."

http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/2873539.htm
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Fat Man »

How about this!!!

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ImageI'm fat and sassy! I love to sing & dance & stomp my feet & really rock your world!

All I want to hear from an ex-jock is "Will that be paper or plastic?" After that he can shut the fuck up!
Heah comes da judge! Heah comes da judge! Order in da court 'cuz heah comes da judge!
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Agent 47 »

Ha! That looks like someone that's just discovered that their inbox is full of sports spam! :twisted:
"We can’t find a healthy brain in an ex-football player."

http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/2873539.htm
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Ray
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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Earl wrote:And we seem to be in a dilemma. Sports fans, even the abusive ones, seem to add a certain something to the forum. (Of course, the abuse can be tolerated only to a certain point.) They seem to add life to the forum. When there are no sports fans at all posting in the forum, there's less activity. See what I mean when I say that we're in a dilemma? To borrow an expression from a completely different setting: Sports fans. You can't live with 'em, and you can't live without 'em.
It's true. <sigh> :)

And I agree. As someone once said, it would be boring if we all just agreed on everything.
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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dickfilthy wrote:
Ray wrote: I personally don't have much use for sports fans and aren't really interested in their point of view. Or anything they have to say.
Yeah, and you don't even really need an actual sports bore around to simulate the effect of talking to one of them, anyway.

All you need to do, to simulate the effect of talking to a sports bore, is this...
Banghead.gif

BWAAAA HA HA HA HA I endured several hours of televised football last night in the office. Luckily we have other offices we can retreat to until the sports bores are sated. That's exactly what I felt like doing --TO THEM!
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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damn fatman --you always top everybody!
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by ChrisOH »

Earl wrote: Could you share your conflicted view of sports with us. I would be interested in knowing what the source is of this conflict in your life. I'm sure that some, if not all, of us would be able to relate to it. This forum definitely is the place to vent and say things that you ordinarily wouldn't say.
Sure....you may have already read my rant about my high school PE experiences and so forth, and as I mentioned, that was a snippet of my conflicted views! :)

I've always been somewhat of a "stat freak", so I was drawn to sports as a child in large part by the numbers -- batting averages, points per game, won-loss percentage, etc. I loved to keep track of these things and compare players and teams with each other. (This extended -- and still does -- beyond sports; I kept weather logs with temperatures and averages from the time I was in high school, and eventually used the data in a school science fair.) I was enthralled also by the dramatic commentary on sports broadcasts, how they made every game and every play seem like the world was riding on it.

Unfortunately, my skills at tabulating sports didn't extend to the playing field; I played one season of Little League baseball, was miserable, and never wanted to play again. I still liked to watch it, though, for the same reasons mentioned above.

Now in high school, besides my bad PE experiences and all, I hated the fact that girls only seemed to like the guys who were athletes, and even guys who had been my friends in grade school suddenly stopped hanging out with me, even if they didn't play sports, so they could befriend the "jocks" and be cool. (These were girls and guys I had grown up with and used to be respected by, but they were more drawn to guys with numbers and names on the backs of jerseys than to someone they'd been friends with since childhood, apparently.) So, I began to resent sports (at least school sports) and those who played and coached them. I still watched TV sports out of habit, although not nearly as much.

When I went to college and then on to work, I still maintained some interest, but sporadically -- I didn't watch every game, and didn't know who all the league leaders were in every sport, etc. It was just one more entertainment option I had -- sometimes I chose it, sometimes I didn't.

After I met my girlfriend and now-wife ten years ago, I cut back on sports viewing even more, as she's a *very* casual sports viewer (and by casual, I mean she'll watch the first five to ten minutes of a "big game" and then either fall asleep or find something else to do -- and if sports were taken off TV, she'd never miss it) and naturally, I wanted to spend time going places and doing things we both enjoyed.

The last place I worked, though, was with several guys who were big-time "sports bores" as some the forum users have been ranked. :) They knew every play of the game from the night before and analyzed them in minute detail all day long. I couldn't keep up with them, given that I didn't watch the games regularly enough anymore. When they'd ask me if I watched the game, I'd usually say no, and they'd jump on me about how I didn't support the team, my city, etc. If I mentioned I watched something else (like a movie, a National Geographic special, etc.) they'd laugh and tell me how while I was wasting my time watching that stuff, I missed an overtime thriller involving the Cleveland Browns or Cavaliers, or whomever, and that I was probably the only person in the whole city that watched whatever I was watching; everyone else would have been watching the game. If I mentioned doing something with my wife and not seeing the game, they said I was "whipped" and that a real man would just tell his wife he was watching the game and that's that. So, I learned to stop talking about subjects other than sports (I also collect coins and attend birdwatching events and hikes, but when I brought these up, I was told that these were "nerdy" activities, and that again, I should be watching sports), and I also decided I needed to watch more sports to keep up with these guys.

I no longer work there, but a couple of years ago, my wife and her mother told me I wasn't like other men, because I had different interests and most men they knew were only concerned about when the next sports game was on. I'm sure they meant this as a compliment, but I started to fear I was "losing my manhood", since the guys I had worked with, and guys I'd see portrayed on TV commercial, sitcoms, comic strips, etc. always seemed to watch sports, even when it made their wives upset. So I started watching even more sports, so much so that I felt guilty if I missed a "big game" by the local teams or a playoff game. The time I spent with my wife suffered as a result, and she began to complain about it. I knew in my mind I watched too much sports, and that I'd never accomplish anything with my life if I was constantly having to plan around sports watching, but I couldn't bring myself to give it up, or even cut back. I started looking for sites on the web about people who were giving up sports or who just didn't like them, to see if anyone had similar feelings or experiences, and to see what people were like who didn't watch sports. That's about the time I found this site.

I've tried watching a few sports games since coming on here, just to gauge my true interest level now that I knew the other side of the equation. I've found I have a hard time keeping interested in the games, even if it's teams I used to like. The football games, for example, seem monotonous much of the time, just one mundane play after another, punctuated by unintelligible and pointless interviews with players and coaches, or the announcers going on and on about how "these guys really don't like each other -- this is gonna be a war!"

So I guess my conflict is that I feel compelled to watch sports, for social reasons and that nagging feeling about possibly missing a historic game and being the "only person around" who didn't see it, yet I know I was watching way too much of it, it was having a negative impact on my marriage, and there's many more interesting things I'd rather be doing and exploring. Plus, how do I tell people (like family and friends) that I don't watch sports anymore (at the rate my interest is waning, I suspect I may be watching no sports at all within a year or so), especially when they've given me sports-related clothing, tickets to games, etc. as gifts in the past, or accommodated me by having "the game" on TV when I came to visit? Will they be happy for me, or just think something's wrong with me?
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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ChrisOH wrote:The football games, for example, seem monotonous much of the time, just one mundane play after another, punctuated by unintelligible and pointless interviews with players and coaches, or the announcers going on and on about how "these guys really don't like each other -- this is gonna be a war!"
I concur. I bet those commentators get bored stiff of having to constantly keep talking over matches and try and make it sound like their words haven't been said a billion times before (which they probably have). But remember, that when it comes to major league sports in any country, most of the people who aren't playing the game are in it for just two things - the money and the fame. Heck, I might even be tempted to talk about some guys kicking a ball round a field for 90 minutes straight if I knew that everyone in the country would be hearing my voice and there would be a nice big paycheck waiting for me at the end of it all. You know, when the wealth of the football industry in Britain finally burns out due to showering it upon players in obscene quantities for years on end, just about everyone who works for it will be gone just like that - they're all only motivated by money nowadays.

Best regards,
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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ChrisOH wrote:
I no longer work there, but a couple of years ago, my wife and her mother told me I wasn't like other men, because I had different interests and most men they knew were only concerned about when the next sports game was on. I'm sure they meant this as a compliment, but I started to fear I was "losing my manhood", since the guys I had worked with, and guys I'd see portrayed on TV commercial, sitcoms, comic strips, etc. always seemed to watch sports, even when it made their wives upset.
Man, that really sucks --it's those thoughtless, unintentionally hurtful remarks that often seem to carry the most weight. I think I know how you feel. But no one should be made to feel less than a man just because they don't like sports! I am sick of these stereotypes being perpetuated by TV! I am telling you that you are not one bit less a man if you don't like sports. You're not more of man either. It really has no relevance to a person's character.

I don't like barbequing (sp?) --I'm supposed to love BBQing because I'm a man --but I don't! I have a lazy streak a mile wide and there is absolutely nothing interesting to me about walking in and out of the house a couple dozen times carrying plates and utensils. If you ask me, it's strictly women's work. Why would I want to go outside and stand in the sun trying to cook on second rate camping gear?? I have a perfectly good stove in the house. Not that I cook, but if I did, I'd do it inside and not outside. I think the stereotypical man's bbq apron is as ludicrous as watching sports. Somehow people accept that slightly easier than me not watching sports --but just slightly. People are such slaves to stereotype.

I hope you learn to accept yourself for who you are and realize that sports are just not your thing --if they really aren't. It's kind of hard for me to understand how anyone could ever have liked something and then changed their mind. That's sort of like saying I was a baptist but now I'm thinking I'm a devout Jew. But I'll take you at your word. I know that my wife used to be wild about certain soap operas but when she hadn't seen them for years and all the characters had changed, when she tried to watch them again, she couldn't muster any interest. Maybe that's how it is for you. :)

And that's the only way that I can imagine anyone having any interest in sports --by some kind of history or knowledge of the characters playing. Anyway, I know the sting (about not liking sports/being a real man) is twice as bad when it comes from a woman but don't let it get you down. You're perfectly normal.
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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ChrisOH wrote: I've always been somewhat of a "stat freak", so I was drawn to sports as a child in large part by the numbers -- batting averages, points per game, won-loss percentage, etc. I loved to keep track of these things and compare players and teams with each other. (This extended -- and still does -- beyond sports; I kept weather logs with temperatures and averages from the time I was in high school, and eventually used the data in a school science fair.) I was enthralled also by the dramatic commentary on sports broadcasts, how they made every game and every play seem like the world was riding on it.
Yeah, that was pretty much exactly what drew me to sports originally. Even Fat Man recounts having enjoyed a make-believe D&D style "baseball game" that he and a friend played over beers back in the 70s with old baseball cards. There were dice involved, and I expect the rules for who hit safely had something to do with the stat-lines on the back of the cards.

--RF

(I'm still into numbers, and I wouldn't say no to a job at a Vegas sports-book. The only difference now is that it would involve only numbers, and I would not even bother to read more about the games than the final score lines.)
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Fat Man »

recovering_fan wrote:
ChrisOH wrote: I've always been somewhat of a "stat freak", so I was drawn to sports as a child in large part by the numbers -- batting averages, points per game, won-loss percentage, etc. I loved to keep track of these things and compare players and teams with each other. (This extended -- and still does -- beyond sports; I kept weather logs with temperatures and averages from the time I was in high school, and eventually used the data in a school science fair.) I was enthralled also by the dramatic commentary on sports broadcasts, how they made every game and every play seem like the world was riding on it.
Yeah, that was pretty much exactly what drew me to sports originally. Even Fat Man recounts having enjoyed a make-believe D&D style "baseball game" that he and a friend played over beers back in the 70s with old baseball cards. There were dice involved, and I expect the rules for who hit safely had something to do with the stat-lines on the back of the cards.

--RF
Well actually, we didn't use the old baseball card themselves. My friend wrote down the statistics from the backs of the baseball cards to some note cards, and of course, he had a book of baseball statistics to write down the data on players for which he didn't have any cards.

Then we selected the players we wanted on our teams, and then we set up the 4 bases on the kitchen table, rolled the dice, and moved the cards around on the table.

Incidentally, my team won!

I actually enjoyed playing baseball on the kitchen table. It was fun.

Then about a year ago, I actually won a football bet!!!

I have a friend, he has a PhD in psychology, and he happens to be my therapist. He's Jewish, and he is like an older brother to me. He had diagnosed me with PTSD, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder back in 2001.

OK, he does like to watch a football game on TV during Sunday afternoons, but he's not fanatical about it.

Anyway, he asked my opinion as to which team I thought was going to win.

So, I asked where the teams came from, what cities and states, and where the game was being held, what city and state, and I inquired about the weather conditions where the game was being held, and the time of the day.

Base on the data, where the teams came from, where they were playing, and the weather conditions, I told him which team I thought would win.

Well, he called back after the game was over to tell me that he had won the football bet, based on my estimate using weather data, the location of the game, and where the teams came from.

I don't know shit about football, but I can tell how people will perform depending on the environment and how well people are adapted to a particular environment.

Anyway, he dropped by my apartment and with his winnings from his football bet, and he took me out that day, and treated me to lunch at an all you can eat Chinese buffet.

Now, I can't do basketball because it's played indoors and is not effected by weather conditions.

I can only do it for games played outdoors.

Back in the late 1970s, my sister had placed a football bet. It was the Minnesota Vikings against another team from California. I don't remember the other team. The game was held somewhere in California, but it was during the winter months, and it was unusually cold for California on that particular day. My sister was watching the game on TV, and I came into the living-room, and I could see it was snowing. She told me on which team she placed her bet, and I said, "Nah! I think the Vikings are going to win this one!"

Then I went back into my bed room to read a book, because I didn't care to watch a stupid football game on TV.

Anyway, the Vikings had won, just as I said they would, my sister got all pissed of because she lost a bet, and she threw a shoe at me!

I just laughed at her for being such a sore loser.
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All I want to hear from an ex-jock is "Will that be paper or plastic?" After that he can shut the fuck up!
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Re: Jocks on forums?

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Ray wrote:
I don't like barbequing (sp?) --I'm supposed to love BBQing because I'm a man --but I don't! I have a lazy streak a mile wide and there is absolutely nothing interesting to me about walking in and out of the house a couple dozen times carrying plates and utensils. If you ask me, it's strictly women's work.
Not trying to argue, but isn't that stereotypical as well, saying these activities or "women's work", just as much as saying sports are "men's things"? Personally, I know some women who don't know how to cook, don't like to, etc., and some men who love to. Again, not wanting to argue, just to understand where you're coming from.
Ray wrote:
Why would I want to go outside and stand in the sun trying to cook on second rate camping gear?? I have a perfectly good stove in the house. Not that I cook, but if I did, I'd do it inside and not outside. I think the stereotypical man's bbq apron is as ludicrous as watching sports. Somehow people accept that slightly easier than me not watching sports --but just slightly. People are such slaves to stereotype.
Well, I don't have an apron :lol: but I do like meat cooked on the grill. I also enjoy food cooked indoors (most making and eating it!) but there's a certain taste I get from flame-grilled meat (and sometimes potatoes, corn and beans) that the stove or oven just doesn't provide. To me, that's worth the extra effort and inconvenience of grilling outdoors. Plus, I just enjoy being outside, so I don't consider it much of an inconvenience. But, you're right, it has nothing to do with "manliness" -- simply my taste and preference.

Ray wrote: I hope you learn to accept yourself for who you are and realize that sports are just not your thing --if they really aren't. It's kind of hard for me to understand how anyone could ever have liked something and then changed their mind. That's sort of like saying I was a baptist but now I'm thinking I'm a devout Jew. But I'll take you at your word. I know that my wife used to be wild about certain soap operas but when she hadn't seen them for years and all the characters had changed, when she tried to watch them again, she couldn't muster any interest. Maybe that's how it is for you. :)
Actually, the religious comparison is quite apt for me. I was devout Christian in my early 20's but have been an atheist for 15 years now. With that, I came to see the flaws in the Christian religion and the contradictions so many of its followers espoused, and realized that if I were intellectually honest with myself, I could no longer call myself a believer. It's been a similar thing with sports (which isn't unlike a religion for so many people).
Ray wrote: You're perfectly normal.
There are those who would debate that, but thank you! :lol:
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Re: Jocks on forums?

Post by Fat Man »

Actually, it was men who invented cooking.

Way back, about 100,000 years ago, when humans discovered how to use fire, the women would go into the forest to gather wild fruit, roots and berries while the men would go out hunting.

Then, it was the men who would build the fire and cook the meat over the open flames.

I have know women who said that men make better cooks.

And there are some guys who won't allow their wives in the kitchen and prefer to do the cooking.

I know, I love to cook!

Ever know a fat guy who couldn't cook?
ImageI'm fat and sassy! I love to sing & dance & stomp my feet & really rock your world!

All I want to hear from an ex-jock is "Will that be paper or plastic?" After that he can shut the fuck up!
Heah comes da judge! Heah comes da judge! Order in da court 'cuz heah comes da judge!
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